12 Commando - Bruneval

I am looking for confirmation that my father Alfred Stanley Morgan ( Stan Morgan) served in 12 Commando ( as a Cpl).

He took part in the Bruneval raid as a gunner on the landing craft. He was then badged as 11th Battalion Royal Fusiliers. From 7.2.42 to 2.3.42 - he was posted to HMS Prins Albert.

I have press photographs and newspaper articles following the Bruneval raid which identify him as a Commando -(he was a professional footballer) though this is not recorded in his service record and he did not discuss this with his family.

From Jan 1943 until 1946 he served in 6th Battalion ( Royal Welch) Parachute Regiment.

Dad was on Arsenal's books from 39-46 - the reason for the post raid newspaper articles. The other Arsenal player on the Bruneval raid was Cyril Tooze -also a Fusilier - and probably 12 Commando. He was later killed in Italy - but CWGC does not list a secondary Commando unit for him.

I would be grateful for any advice where I could look for information on 12 Commando. Would the diaries in the National Archives be of any help to me?

Thanks.

Richard Morgan

Hi Richard

May I wish you a very warm welcome to the CVA, although I do not have any in depth knowledge regarding No.12 Cmd, I am sure others on this site will be able to provide you with guidance on books etc to help rectify this situation. I am just replying to make you aware, (if you are not already) that you can apply for a copy of your fathers Army records, I and quite a few others on this site have done this already and have received copies of some very interesting original documents in reply. The following link will take you to the section of the Forum that contains the web site of the Army Personnel Centre that deals with these enquiries.

http://www.commandoveterans.org/cdoForum/posts/list/179.page

Also have you checked out the photos for No.12 in our gallery, the following link will take you to the two photos of the landing craft containing the Commandos who provided support the Paras during their withdrawal after the Bruneval raid.

http://www.commandoveterans.org/cdoGallery/v/units/12/

Finally It would be a great contribution to our archive if you could upload any photos that you may have of your father's time with No.12, including the press photos and articles that you have, on to our gallery. If you would like to do this but are not sure on how to do it, then I or others on this site would be only too happy to do this for you.

Good luck with your research, cheers Andy

Hello Richard

Welcome to the CVA forums.

My father Bob Mewett also served in 12 Cdo and I have also viewed the War Diaries at Kew for No 12 . They are not very helpful ............but please don't let me put you off from viewing them. 12 Cdo are a bit of an enigma............have you read Sgt John Huntingdons memories on the front page of this site?. Do you have any other info for your dad.. eg Troop served in etc.

Best regards

JohnM

Dear John and Andy,

Thanks for the information and comments. I obtained my father's military records a couple of year's ago. There is no mention of any Commando service.

During this period of the war when he visited his family in Wales he only told them that he was working in the North Sea and spent long periods on ships (and barges).

The newspaper articles I mentioned are attached. I also have a press photo I'll attach later. Obviously the contents are from official sources - designed for a bit of positive publicity.

Regards,

Richard

This message was edited 5 times. Last update was at 11/10/2010 14:01:29

The Bruneval raid - Operation Biting - is well documented, with copies of many of the official reports included, in a book called Striking Back - Britains Commando and Airborne Raids 1940 -1942 by Niall Cherry. These documents are also available at the National Archives. Niall quotes from the official report written by Major General Browning after the raid concerning the manning of the ALC's. In that report Browning states one officer and 25 OR's from each of 4th Monmouth Regiment and 11th Battallion Royal Fusiliers were used to provided the required numbers and reserves for each of the ALC's, and they were posted to HMS Prins Albert. So that fits in with the fact you say

He took part in the Bruneval raid as a gunner on the landing craft. He was then badged as 11th Battalion Royal Fusiliers. From 7.2.42 to 2.3.42 - he was posted to HMS Prins Albert.

There were many support units for this raid in addition to the Paratroops that actually were involved. The six ALC's mentioned above were acompanied by two LSC's and also MGB's. Royal Engineers, Signallers, RAMC, all assisted with others from the RN and RAF. Our history section mentions a recovery party from 12 Commando took part but I have no information to add to this. Perhaps someone else can clarify whether they were on the LSC's or MGB's? It was an Airborne Raid not a Commando Raid but in those days British Paratroopers were new and the Press likely saw them as Commandos (which is where they originated from).

Regards

Pete

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 11/10/2010 19:04:48

Hi everybody

I talked with John Huntington (Sgt. No 12) about this raid on several occasions.
As far as I can recall No 12 supplied the recovery force for the Paras and the radar.

Manning four Bren Guns each on LCA's.......not sure how many LCA's
involved.

Although I think a section of men were involved..........this would indicate about 30 men to me.

A snippet.

Best regards

John M

Hi
There was a documentary recently about the raid on the yesterday channel. Some original footage was shown towards the end, don?t know if you can watch it on I player
Regards chris

Thanks to all for the replies and advice.

I have a few more clues and a couple of photographs which I'll dig out when I return to HK next week.

I have read John Huntingdon's recollection's and the only connections that I can see, are that my Dad was from a Fusilier Regt. and definitley served on the Prins Albert at the relevant time.

I also noted the name M-G Coran Purdon as being in 12 Commando. I worked in the same organistion as him in the 1980s and met him a couple of times. If I had known then what I know now, I might have been able to ask him a few questions.

Regards,

Richard

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 17/10/2010 22:16:03

I also noted the name M-G Coran Purdon as being in 12 Commando. I worked in the same organistion as him in the 1980s and met him a couple of times. If I had known then what I know now, I might have been able to ask him a few questions.

Richard...You should ask him then ...he is still alive and attending reunions for the St Nazaire raid which he took part in on 28th March '42, and was subsequently captured, ending up in Colditz.

http://www.commandoveterans.org/cdoForum/posts/list/1562.page

http://www.commandoveterans.org/cdoGallery/v/events/Dieppe_001/FRANCE/Major+General+Corran+PURDON.jpg.html

Regards

Pete

Hello Richard

Maj Gen Purdon is also a member of the CVA I believe.

You may be able to contact him through HQ?

Regards

John M

Dear Members,

I have posted a press photograph, Daily Express, of which I have a hard copy. In Fusiliers uniform with an officer (of Fusiliers?) The caption on the back reads "S. Morgan (Arsenal) who took part in the Commando raid on Bruneval chats to Brighton players in their dressing room at Milwall where he guested for them. Brighton lost 2-0."

With regard to photographs of the raid ( and I've also looked at those on the Paradata site), I would say that the Cpl (?) in the photograph on this site, copied below appears to show my father (circled). Anyway, maybe wishful thinking -but should not be unexpected, and is still only confirmation of his Fusilier service.

My brother's view is that a line infantryman from a Territorial Regt. would not have been sent on such a mission. My doubt is that if he was 12 Commando why name him and put his photograph in the national papers - even for the positive morale effect.

I'll try to follow up the M-G Purdon matter - and I have a couple of avenues to do that.

Rgds,

Richard Morgan

Hi Richard Morgan,

I thought I recognised your photograph.

Check this one from my own collection.

Regards

I was able to visit the Royal Fusiliers Museum in the Tower of London, when I was in UK a couple of weeks ago, and met the lady who runs the Museum and their archivist. They seemed to have no particular knowledge of the involvement of 11th Battalion RF in the Bruneval raid. It doesn't seem to be part of RF history. They also told me that 11th Battalion (which was a Territorial Battalion) did not serve overseas during WWII and has no war diary.

I have now asked one of my acquaintances to help me go through the 12 Commando War dairy and other relevant documents in the National Archives at Kew, to see if there are any clues there.

Richard M.

Hi Richard

Does your father's service record show anything about him ever being in the Manchester Regiment? There is, I have discovered, an unofficial reference to an Alfred Stanley Morgan being in No 12 Commando but only for a very short period of 3 months in 1941

Regards

Pete

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 17/12/2011 15:32:06

Hello Pete,

Yes, that is my father's full name. He did not serve in the Manchester Regiment ( according to his service record which I have). He was a RF, followed by the Parachute Regiment.

In early 1941 his location seems to be Harpenden. In August 1941 his location is recorded as Pebworth. From 4.12 41 it becomes New Milton. From 4.3.42 he is attached to HMS Prins Albert, and by September 1942 Southampton. All of his Unit column records 11 R. F. for this period. Entered Airborne Forces Depot on 27.1.43.

Don't know whether the locations offer any clues?

Regards,

Richard